How Death States will effect the gameplay ?

[Raziel103]

hi, after i looked at the Wraith art reveal video i start to understand how the death states will effect the game but there is some questions i want to ask about the system.
when i saw this image here what i thought about the system
Vampire will have 3 health bars (metirial/mana/essent)
Wraith 2 health bars (mana/essent)
Revenant 1 health (meterial)
i think from what i understand in the Wraith art video that every class have all the 3 states, and some classes will be stronger in some states and weaker in others.
maybe that ok if some states work like a come back from death mechanic for some classes but you also talked about the player have a way to power up states over the others but from what i seen you didn't talk about this way and that also made me have other questions like:
-are all states will have the same abilities with small changes in effects or every states will have it own abilities ?
-how the player gain xp ? by killing enemies or every class have a way like vamp the more blood he suck, or ghoul the more meat he eat ... ?
-how to power up/ add skills to the player? with talents tree or other ways ? and if talents tree it will work like world of warcraft (every states is wow class spec
and player can power up spec/states over the other)? or a unique way that allow to mix the upgrades between the states like for example add mana effect to physical/meterial ability and have attack with spell effects ?

so if every state will have it own abilities and it own gameplay style so how you guys plan to balance this states because if the classes + the states are not balanced some classes and states gonna be "meta" and more played in the player base and other classes will have less popularity and in the way you gonna use ages to create the lore the gameplay and lore will have many problems.

my main question here is how you guys plan to balance the classes with all this complicated systems in the game ?

a bonus question in the same topic i want to ask, is there spirital/spectral realm for some classes states or all the states are in the physical world ? (insperation from LoK SR )

 

[Varik Keldun]

-are all states will have the same abilities with small changes in effects or every states will have it own abilities ?
-how the player gain xp ? by killing enemies or every class have a way like vamp the more blood he suck, or ghoul the more meat he eat ... ?
-how to power up/ add skills to the player? with talents tree or other ways ? and if talents tree it will work like world of warcraft (every states is wow class spec
and player can power up spec/states over the other)? or a unique way that allow to mix the upgrades between the states like for example add mana effect to physical/meterial ability and have attack with spell effects ?

so if every state will have it own abilities and it own gameplay style so how you guys plan to balance this states because if the classes + the states are not balanced some classes and states gonna be "meta" and more played in the player base and other classes will have less popularity and in the way you gonna use ages to create the lore the gameplay and lore will have many problems.

my main question here is how you guys plan to balance the classes with all this complicated systems in the game ?

a bonus question in the same topic i want to ask, is there spirital/spectral realm for some classes states or all the states are in the physical world ? (insperation from LoK SR )

Q- Are all states will have the same abilities with small changes in effects or every states will have it own abilities ?
A- From what we have been told each state will have its own abilites.

Q-How the player gain xp ? by killing enemies or every class have a way like vamp the more blood he suck, or ghoul the more meat he eat ... ?
A-Being an action RPG I would assume the main way to gain EXP is to kill enemies, though quests, and other tasks may gain exp as well (possibly even EXP for those tasks or trade skills)

Q-how to power up/ add skills to the player? with talents tree or other ways ? and if talents tree it will work like world of warcraft (every states is wow class spec and player can power up spec/states over the other)? or a unique way that allow to mix the upgrades between the states like for example add mana effect to physical/meterial ability and have attack with spell effects ?
so if every state will have it own abilities and it own gameplay style so how you guys plan to balance this states because if the classes + the states are not balanced some classes and states gonna be "meta" and more played in the player base and other classes will have less popularity and in the way you gonna use ages to create the lore the gameplay and lore will have many problems.
A- The talent system has not been revealed to us but has been stated that it will be something we haven't seen before and each class will have their own skillsets and enough Variety to hopefully not make "META" characters

Q-my main question here is how you guys plan to balance the classes with all this complicated systems in the game ?
A-Balance in just about every game is something that constantly has to be assessed, monitored and tweaked.

Q-Bonus question in the same topic i want to ask, is there spirital/spectral realm for some classes states or all the states are in the physical world ? (insperation from LoK SR )
A-From what we have been told there will be 1 realm for all 3 states. but there will be different dimensions that could be traveled to.


As an aside on balance THIS is one of my favorite WoW references on Balance

 

[Raziel103]

Q- Are all states will have the same abilities with small changes in effects or every states will have it own abilities ?
A- From what we have been told each state will have its own abilites.

Q-How the player gain xp ? by killing enemies or every class have a way like vamp the more blood he suck, or ghoul the more meat he eat ... ?
A-Being an action RPG I would assume the main way to gain EXP is to kill enemies, though quests, and other tasks may gain exp as well (possibly even EXP for those tasks or trade skills)

Q-how to power up/ add skills to the player? with talents tree or other ways ? and if talents tree it will work like world of warcraft (every states is wow class spec and player can power up spec/states over the other)? or a unique way that allow to mix the upgrades between the states like for example add mana effect to physical/meterial ability and have attack with spell effects ?
so if every state will have it own abilities and it own gameplay style so how you guys plan to balance this states because if the classes + the states are not balanced some classes and states gonna be "meta" and more played in the player base and other classes will have less popularity and in the way you gonna use ages to create the lore the gameplay and lore will have many problems.
A- The talent system has not been revealed to us but has been stated that it will be something we haven't seen before and each class will have their own skillsets and enough Variety to hopefully not make "META" characters

Q-my main question here is how you guys plan to balance the classes with all this complicated systems in the game ?
A-Balance in just about every game is something that constantly has to be assessed, monitored and tweaked.

Q-Bonus question in the same topic i want to ask, is there spirital/spectral realm for some classes states or all the states are in the physical world ? (insperation from LoK SR )
A-From what we have been told there will be 1 realm for all 3 states. but there will be different dimensions that could be traveled to.


As an aside on balance THIS is one of my favorite WoW references on Balance

thank you for taking your time to respond to this post, i didn't know about this game before so i miss many things so that i have many questions here and now i understand some of the things about the game.

about the wow video they talk about pvp balance not pve and from what i know about this game it will not focus on the pvp and they will focus more on the pve experiance so think about something like Diablo or Path of Exiel, in Action RPG games there is some classes hae more players than others but most of the classes are popular in A-RPG games.
but in the builds people will try to use the best build for thier class and like what Denis said classes like Revenants are more stronger in thier meterial forms, even the stats trinity image prove that so if i go Revenants why i build him in magical or essents form if i know that his meterial form is the strongest ?

 

[Golden Xan]

They intend to build the game in such a way that all players can specialize the classes in whatever state they prefer. So you could have a Revenant that focuses on the Ethereal form, for instance, and become powerful in its own way. But we need to wait and see how the skill system will actually work, because so far that is a mystery to us players.

I have once speculated on the Revenant's skills on another post, but come to think of it I don't believe that's the direction they are going with. Fun to think about, anyway.

 

[Raziel103]

They intend to build the game in such a way that all players can specialize the classes in whatever state they prefer. So you could have a Revenant that focuses on the Ethereal form, for instance, and become powerful in its own way. But we need to wait and see how the skill system will actually work, because so far that is a mystery to us players.

I have once speculated on the Revenant's skills on another post, but come to think of it I don't believe that's the direction they are going with. Fun to think about, anyway.

for sure we need to wait and see how the skills system will be like.
here why i am very worried about the classes overall in both gameplay and fantasy.
if you see the image of the classes trinity you will understand that the Vampire can be powerfull in any state but the Revenant is strong only in meterial state and weak in the other 2, like i said before this could be unbalanced but in the sametime if they balnce all the stataes for all the classes the image of the classes trinity is usless and the game and classes will use what made them differents and unique.

so i think it must be different ways to powerup your class and maybe different for each class because for example if you can power up only 1 abiity from 1 state every time you lvl up the dev's will need to secrefice 1 of 2 things, balance or the classes trinity but there is a 3rd option is to make the way of powering up your class different from other games to make sure a class lie the Revenant's stay strong in his meterial form but have option to play with the other forms in different ways.

 

[Golden Xan]

The Trinary Archetype System represents more than just their power. It is also relevant in their lore. For instance, the Wraith stands in the bottom middle, which is between Magick and Essence. That is fitting, because lore-wise, the Wraith is created by separating the body from the soul, killing the body, and performing a magickal binding of the soul.

The Ghoul is created by mixing a body with a spirit of hunger. Thus, Physical and Essence, explaining his position in the triangle. And so on.

But I too wonder what it would be like to play with a Magickal Ghoul, or an Essential Banshee, or a Physical Wraith. I'm eager to see the skill system.

 

[Raziel103]

The Trinary Archetype System represents more than just their power. It is also relevant in their lore. For instance, the Wraith stands in the bottom middle, which is between Magick and Essence. That is fitting, because lore-wise, the Wraith is created by separating the body from the soul, killing the body, and performing a magickal binding of the soul.

The Ghoul is created by mixing a body with a spirit of hunger. Thus, Physical and Essence, explaining his position in the triangle. And so on.

But I too wonder what it would be like to play with a Magickal Ghoul, or an Essential Banshee, or a Physical Wraith. I'm eager to see the skill system.

here you sacrefice the lore over the gameplay and that not good for people who like the lore.
here a small idea i think it could work, if you looked at Diablo 4 demo druid gameplay you will see the druid transform to the form of the ability he cast. so what in Deadhaus i can mix my action bar with abilities from all the states and as a Revenant i have more attack power and hp in the red metirial form but if i cast magical or essance ability i transform to that form the moment i cast the ability, so player can mix his build without powering one over the other even if there is 1 form is stronger than the others.